Any way to deal with Charm users?

To be Honest I just recently have started doing PvP on the app on the UL, all thing were going smoothly with my team until I started to find more and more fairies (that type should not exist and nothing can change my mind from it), and my team has nothing to do against them:

Lucky Milotic
2500 CP
Dragon Tail

2497 CP
130 HP

Grass Knot
Sludge Bomb

Those 2 are the core of my team.

Previously was:


Blast Burn
Focus Blast



Wild Charge

I have replaced them for a Heatran that technically fills the fire attacker role while its charged move it Iron Head.
No way that I unlock its second charged move.

I even raised a Lucky Metagross but I ran out of candies and regardless it doesn’t Meteor Mash. So no second charged move.

Finally added a Sceptile but its too fragile to win a 1 vs 1 versus that pesky Sylveon or Clefable.

I am trying to raise an Abomasnow but I don’t have infinite resources.

While my team kinda struggles with Swampert and Giratina - A I kinda can manage against them, however Sylveon completely wrecks me by forcing me to change.

And then this post it’s just a covertly rant about Charm, which and absurd DPS and energy generation that simply put lacks answer, even resistant matchups are hard and neutral are just a lost battle, I would love to say that attack should get a major nerf on its energy generation but I bet I am not the first that thinks so.

Regardless that, any idea or suggestion?

Scizor running fury cutter with iron head and night slash is a good hard fairy counter in UL that has lots of play outside the hard counter role too. Gives Gira-A a run for the money too. Second move is expensive but raising one to UL level isn’t too bad otherwise.

Charm’s EPT (energy generation) isn’t really that great, it’s the raw power and few resistances that it lives on. It could use a small damage nerf, yes.

Edit: Melmetal if you have the mystery box link with Pokémon home, that’s another top notch accessible fairy counter in UL. A lot of the other ones are really expensive, Nidoqueen, Registeel, Skarmory, G-Stunfisk.

Venusaur with Sludge and Magnezone are two other relatively cheap options that are viable as well, Venu more then Magnezone if you have a frenzy plant one to use.

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Consider raising up an Ice type, since majority Charm users in UL are Togekiss (half Flying, easy Ice target) and in addition to that Tina doesn’t want to see it either.

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I do have a Venusaur, I’ll give it a try hoping it solves most of my problems.
But now that you put that way about Charm if only they made it be slower that would solve everything, its just overwhelming that deals so much damage in so short time.

Uhm, I am rising an Abomasnow, but even its current CP is 2000 so still kinda underwhelming.
Mostly my bane are pure Fairies like Sylveon and Clefable, Togekiss in UL haven’t battled one as that thing I believe its most used on ML, but anyway Thanks (and technically Abomasnow does hardly counter Giratina and Swampert so that’s why I am raising one but still no more candy available).

Any Empoleon with Hydro Cannon? That’s a thicc boy and also won’t instantly melt vs Fire like many Steel types. You could even run Metal Claw for the fast move to get rid of them quicker.

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Empoleon is good thought too, good call. Venusaur is a bit of a softer counter, honestly Frenzy is so strong and fast you could skip sludge if you wanted, but doubled moved is always better. Watch out for fire and ice obviously, and there’s lots, and he’s useless against Gir-A, but you can’t go too wrong making a UL Venusaur, he’s a solid meta Mon.

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Nope, no Empoleon, but that’s a great choice too, that could allow me to bring a secondary team with my water one being him, so far Milotic does great and only struggles with phew units, she even can manage with some Electric and Grass pokemon if I have shields to spare.

I don’t see any togekiss anymore since two seasons. Usually it’s clefable, often also Sylveon and Granbull. Sometimes Alolan Ninetales
Personally, I use an empoleon, but without hydro Cannon it’s not that good.
But you’re right in a way, since icicle spear walrein is one of the few neutral mons beating charmers with bulk, spam and high damage (and not being that expensive). Lapras also good.
@Imrahil001 - or just wait, there is also a time without charmers, they come (and go) in waves ;)
Waterfall milotic might be a partly solution, but then dragon matchups are bad…

Or another idea is try just running a Charmer VS a Charmer. It’s mutually assured destruction and most likely they will switch out if you can commit, so then you’ve done some respectable damage and it’s easier to deal with later

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The last two seasons I’ve used a shadow skuntank that can often times farm down a charmer and then toss out a couple of crunches on whatever switches in next. Bonus points if I hit their charmer switch in with a Jellicent Bubblebeam before switching in Skuntank.

My advice is more generic, good across the whole game. Patience and planning.

It’s frustrating when you don’t have the stuff it feels like everyone’s already got tons of.

A lot of things are best sidelined pre-evolution until you can give one it’s elite/signature move. You’ve got a Metagross without Meteor Mash, don’t evolve another until you get an event where it can learn it - Beldum are still rare enough that, as a new player, you can’t reliably get hold of many candies outside an event.

What I’d advise are:

  1. Before evolving or powering anything, check out using the rankings and team builder to see what it is good for, what it counters and what it is best partnered with.

  2. Check out the Gamepress write up too - sometimes the pvpoke rankings need a little context. Use this to find out what has elite moves too.

  3. This is a game of resource management, especially early on, look to cheaper options for now so you can build more options with the same dust, unless what you want to work on next is top tier meta stuff. But balance it when you can. On that note, whilst not a hard counter, Swampert can blunt Charmers to some degree and so, as well as being good in its own right, could be a good budget coverage answer to them while you work out your alternatives. That said, you’d still need an ice/rock/electric to tackle Togekiss, but that’s coverage that’s available in a lot of UL mon. .

  4. Take the early losses as a learning curve. You just won’t have the teams to beat a lot of things right now.

  5. Enjoy the wins, they’ll come.

  6. Remember PvP involves a big slice of luck and nobody wins 5/5 all the time.

Waiting for an event to get the desired move is painful, next weekend I’ll be giving some more shadow mudkip Hydro Cannon, my oldest was caught 6 months ago. I’ve waited over a year before now for various elite moves. But it’s worth it.

PvP always gets a shake-up on a regular basis, so don’t necessarily worry about getting ‘the’ meta team now, because it’ll likely get nerfed or something else buffed. I’m quite a light PvP player, I’ll get to R20 for the elite TM and then just play when the mood/cup/league takes me, so I don’t worry about having every answer for every option but I generally do alright.

You’ll get there, whilst Charmers are your problem now, once you’ve covered that it’ll be something else - it never ends and the perfect team simply doesn’t exist in PvP. You’ll work it out as and when you build more stuff. On that note, if you can, farm the rockets for 12k eggs as the dust from them is massive and there are some good shadow options (both as shadow and purified) that can be helpful indeed. Plus Scrafty, Vulllaby, Skrelp and Skorupi are in 12k eggs too - mainly for GL but still very useful options.


+1 for Scizor
I will add that Bullet Punch+Night Slash does 95% of the work and is arguably better than running Fury Cutter (Iron Head is pretty trash anyway). In my experience, Scizor is by far the best of the cheap picks for UL. Walls and counters all the psychic, fairy, dragon, and ghost types as well as hard walling almost every grass-type. 10/10 would recommend over an Abomasnow, especially if price is any concern whatsoever. @Imrahil001 If I were you, I’d put it in place of your current fire slot*.

*Heatran is currently the only hard wall for fairy (double-resist) and running Stone Edge isn’t bad for solid neutral damage. Scizor is arguably better though, even single-moved.

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Never tried BP on scizor, think I will, had him out a few times this season since we’re fooling around anyways, dusting stuff off.

All this charm talk reminded me of an old team of Charizard double charmer, although I think I ran Typholosion instead of Charz. Might dust that off too. Or did it change leagues today?

Re: Charm/fairies being a bit OP
The issue is that the only good hard counters are Poison (Fire only resists, Steel-type moves are pretty bad aside from Bullet Punch, Meteor Mash, and Magnet Bomb which are all pretty rare) and Fairy moves tend to hit very hard. Add in the fact that a lot of Poison-types in UL need XL candy and/or aren’t very good and you have a recipe for fairy being a bit OP.

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OP: builds a Scizor

The game: Ok, fantastic, today you’ll be facing every Charizard team


lol its funny 'cause I almost always lead with Pyroar so seeing a Scizor is like:


Who’s been messing up everything?
It’s been algorithm all along

Thanks to all of you that gave me advices and suggestions.

Technically I am not a ‘new’ player, I’ve been playing since 2016, though I stopped playing from time to time.
It wasn’t until February of this year that I started to play PvP, and thus had to invest on teams that can manage for i

So far with UL and Halloween Cup this is my overall ranking, hope I can achieve at least the ranking 19 for the Elites TM.

Thanks for your advices.