Counter all 18 types with just 4 pokemon


#1

Hi trainers

I was scrolling through hundreds and hundreds of pokemon caught, and I wondered to myself how minimalistic I could make my Pokemon experience. How would I be able to beat every type with as few pokemon as possible.

I managed to get the number down to 4 meta relevant (but none legendary!!) pokemon that’ll counter all 18 unique types in the pokemon universe with both STAB and Super Effective bonus.

Mamoswine (can be spec’d for both ice and ground)
Roserade (can be spec’d for both Grass and Poison)
Machamp (fighting)
Honchkrow (can be spec’d for both dark and flying)

I know there’s other combinations out there for a truely minimalistic pokemon go experience. But Imagine that, just 4 different pokemon!

Other combinations could be to switch dark for ghost (they counter the same thing) and whoopti you got Gengar for its ghost-poison coverage (although no poison fast move :( ) Wonder if anyone else can come up with interesting combo’s.??

Best regards and stay safe!

Patrick


#2

Interesting - I think your Mamoswine moves are the wrong way round though :wink:


#3

Could use Breloom in place of Machamp/Roserade and then have a different fairy counter if you wanted too.


#4

In practice, Metagross is much better as a Fairy counter, unless you are excluding legacy moves.


#5

Hi

Fascinating stuff. At least one totally different combination with still relevant Pokemon is:

  1. Rhyperior (Ground & Rock)
  2. Weavile (Ice & Dark)
  3. Metagross (Psychic & Steel)
  4. Breloom (Fighting & Grass)

I think the main difficulty is that you need to have Ground on the setup (due to electric coverage) and not too many good, non-legendary Ground types are available.


#6

That is good enough up to 5 trainers/acc raiding legendary raids, assuming all have high enough level.
But be carefull when duo or trio it, many T5 raids wont be as a walk in the park as Rayquaza raid for example…


#7

You forgot,that some mons have dual types, that cancels some weakneses. In example Scizor is only weak to Fire, Sableye to Fairy , Articuno being neutral to all those mons etc.


#8

Interesting subject. Outside of the pure theory, this is not very useful in raids though (you need multiple specialized counters or generalists). Moreover, you’re cheating when you consider ground Mamoswine and ice Mamoswine as only one pokémon… except if you give it one attack of each type, like Powder Snow+Bulldoze, or if you buy extra moves.

But it is useful to concentrate counter coverage in gyms (so you don’t have to switch and the battle can be faster) or in PvP. Taking into account Ziperro’s comment, note that you could have Powder Snow+Bulldoze+Ancient Power Mamoswine and Poison Jab+Grass Knot+Dazzling Gleam Roserade for additional coverage: Articuno and Sableye would be covered. Not Scizor though…


#9

I think that the idea here was that one could fill up his teams with multiple individuals from these four species and then have SE+STAB coverage over all single typings. Some dual types could be problem though.


#10

Scince the main series games had also a team of 6 pokemons i tried to build an arena-team covering all single types AND most of the dual types. This was a very interesting challenge for me, because I live in a rural area and i have quite limited resources (Only 1-2 Legendary raidbosses per Month). I come up with the following Team.

  • Lugia/Mewto (Poison, Fighting) prefer Lugia cause sky attack and better resistence but both super strong arena fighter
  • Tyranitar (Flying, Fire, Psychic, Ghost) Smackdown is just amazing and crunch super fast to charge
  • Moltres (Grass, Bug, Steel) -> double resistence and you need fire for scizor
  • Roserade (Fairy, Water, Ground) most dps and my favorite shiny :smiley:
  • Mamoswine (Dragon, Electric) just a placeholder for Garchomp
  • Machamp (Rock, Dark, Normal, Ice) its Machamp

In my opinion this is the best possible arena-team currently :smiley: I am looking forward for your opinions!


#11

Thanks for your feedback guys!
It is one thing I always praise about Pokemon Go, the community is very helpful and not very toxic at all.

Maybe I should state my motivation behind this little exercise…
For new players that needs to be able to contribute faster and small, rural groups that rely on a little ALT help to get through the raids I personly think this may be the most efficiant way of spending the very rare commodity called stardust, compared to your return in raid efficiancy.

And while it absolutely is true (well spotted!) that this set up only counter single unique types and doesn’t take into consideration all the strong dual types, with few weaknesses, you should (at the very least) be able to hit it for neutral damage with these strong pokemon.

The only bulletproof alternative to be able to hit EVERY type and dual type is to make a strong team of 6 pokemon of all 18 types. That is 108 pokemon you want battle ready, the stardust cost of such a set up is insanely high (although I’m almost there on my account after 2+ years).

With the setup above you would only need 42 pokemon to hit all the unique types super effective, and you should be able to hit every single dual type for atleast neutral damage, in case you face off against the Scizor’s of the pokemon world.

The only cheaper solution would be to go full generalists, and focus on 6 dragons as they tend to have the highest neutral DPS in the game while still being widely available. They will give you a coverage of 15 types, then you only had to worry about Ice, Fairy and Steel (its weakness) and Fighting + steel/poison will easily take care of those situations.

THen you could get your team down to:
6 dragons, 6 fighting, 6 poison/steel = 18 Pokemon

So basicly:
108 pokemon for full coverage
42 for full coverage of all the unique types, but not all dual types
18 for a generalist coverage

Does the stardust cost justify the efficiancy? You decide!

Edit: You could in theory get it down to just 12 Pokemon

6 dragons for highest neutral DPS
6 Fire to counter Ice and Steel and resist fairies for high TDO

Huh, how about that.

6 Rayqueza, 6 moltres/entei/flareon <3


#12

I happen to live in an area with small group of trainers, play alone for 2+ years, going to an area that have a large group of trainers for raiding
I only meet 5 trainers around my home when regirock become a raid boss, 4 level 15-25ish, 1 lv 31/32 that just return after long time hiatus.

Aiming for that mostly legendaries counters wont happen to them, the easiest way is just carried them for a while untill they reach Lv 30 so they can save candy and stardust
When they do, i just tell them to watch for a weather boosted spawn and keep every potentially good counter pokemon that need a 5000 stardust or more (machop, exegcute, eevee, etc)
While keep informing in whatever online group when there is an event that spawn a potentially good counter that dont spawn often in the area. Example when swinub, weavile,or even jynx spawn often at the end of 2018,.
Informing about community day and what impact they will do in the meta also help.
Evolve it when you need it when they become a good counter for a current T5.
Trading pokemon that high level player (if there is one) dont need anymore also help
Forget about IV, moveset is the priority. After they have a full squad then they can decide if they wanna create a better squad, or keep using them, as long as it is strong enough to atleast 5 man T5 raid then it is ok.
Way cheaper investment and can win most legendaries raid with 5 man setup without a strong level 40 trainer to carry them anymore.

That is the beauty of a small group, we dont chat unnecesarry things much
So usefull information can be read clearly rather then just bragging about hundo, shinies,etc


#13

That is so great! And honestly the beauty of rural living.

When I travel into a big town there’s usually 10-20 players in raids.
While we can barely get 4 people together at any given time lol.
But as you said, with knowledge, planning and a bit of strategy you can make it work. And I rather have a tight group of 4 than standing around awkwardly in a group of 20 strangers lol.


#14

Okay now i understand your motivation for this particular pokemon selection :wink:
I also agree with it and i need to admit that i underestimated honchkrow :open_mouth:
But as stated by cukaje the best tip for new/minimalistic players is to participate in the community days. It only requires you to play 3 hours a month and you get enough resources and strong pokemons for your local raid group :smiley:


#15

We’ve a fair few new/returning players locally and that’s good advice. I also save decent lv Machops etc., evolve them up and trade them to other players for rubbish - they don’t always roll great IVs, but they provide a useful stop gap for players and helps build up a community of better raiders.


#16

It could get better :blush:
When the group first formed and using WhatsApp for online communication, to be honest i am quite skeptical we’re gonna have a new member.
So i am content with 6 member, atleast we can work something for raid rather than dump the free pass or raid anything just so it wont expired
Turn out, when we raiding a T4 or T5 together, some other trainer see us and ask if they can join.
For 2 years i never experience it, most likely they see a group and they see a chance to get legendaries. They wont ask if they only see one person at the raid
The other way around can happen also, when our group already become stronger to do around 4-5 acc to raid, when they see someone anxious (sign that a pogo player hesitance to ask for join :smile:) they invite em to raid also
Confidence help them to be willing to help others.
Now we have around 15 member altough very rarely all will show up in raid, 4-6 trainers is the norm
On a rare occasion when there is 8-10 trainers gather (ussually at the first day of a new legendaries) they ask me to split up the group and i am gladly doing it.
They used to raid in smaller group and prefer the rewards rather than all trainer raid in one lobby…


#17

That is the great way to help new or returning player especially at the start.
As an active player for a long time, we already have much more candy that we need.
When i catch a high level wild weather boosted i keep it, ask if someone that cannot have a good squad yet for trade, evolve change the fast move to the best one (no charge move unfortunately, i always dont have much of those)
And said just make a battle party and use it, dont bother about the IV, if in the future you wanna do some hardcore mode duo or trio, time attack, then you can search for a better one, but still can keep em to be your reserve…


#18

The theoretical perfect coverage move set involves 9 types - Ground, Dark, Rock, Fighting, Fairy, Fire, Grass, Poison and Water/Ice.

These type combinations cover every single type combination until gen 7, bar Mimikyu (Fairy/Ghost).

Ground - must have since it’s the only SE vs electric. Also covers fire, poison, steel

Fighting - must have since it’s the only SE vs normal. Also covers rock, steel, ice, dark

Dark - Covers psychic and ghost mainly. Can be swapped for ghost type, at the cost of poor coverage vs normal/psychic types

Rock - Covers mainly flying, bug types and remaining fire types like moltres (immune to ground)

Fairy - Dragon coverage (better than Dragon as it also covers fighting types), as well as some dark types not covered by fighting (like sableye)

Fire - Mainly for Grass types, the remaining bugs, and flying/steel types

Grass - Mainly to counter water and ground types, with the rest being countered by their secondary typings

Poison - Mainly counters fairies, and covers for Ludicolo (something steel types can’t cover)

Water/Ice - Only to counter a specific type combination; ground/flying

With that in mind one possible combination might be, assuming a surplus of fast TMs and unlocked 2nd slot;
Weavile (ice, dark), Roserade (poison, grass), Blaziken with Blast burn (Fire, Fighting), Rhyperior (Ground, Rock) Gradevoir/Togekiss (Fairy, Psychic/Flying)

The above pokemon are all among the top damage dealers of their type, bar fighting blaziken. Of course this is all just theoretical and does not factor in the opponents; Some types are more useful than others depending on raid targets availablility, and also depending on raid target movesets.

Also the above pokemon are not THE BEST pokemon for the job; example - 6 TTars/Gengars i believe generally do better vs 6 Weaviles when taking on targets like Deoxys depending on movesets. Also I dont believe TTar to be considered Rock/Dark mixed attackers since their rock fast move cant be TMed and u generally dont want to TM it away.

I always believe in a good mix of pokemon in your team, with more readily available pokemon easier to level given higher lucky potential and candy count.