CP Difference

Can anyone explain how CP affects the attacking power of a Pokemon in raids/gym battles, etc. (not PVP)?

For example, Kyogre is stronger than Kingler is stronger than Gyarados but that’s assuming they’re all the same CP right? However, I have a 3300 Gyarados, is that stronger or weaker than my 2800CP Kingler? Are those stronger than my 2200 Kyogre? What difference does the CP make?

Countless examples of where my other regular Pokemon are easier to invest in and could be a higher CP than a legendary that could be stronger. Should I invest in my Kingler and max it out since I have a ton of candy? Or shoould I power up my Kyogre but I only have 10 candy so it’ll only get to 2400?

What do you think? The above is just an example, just wondering what the overall strategy should be in general.

CP is just a result of 3 different stats (attack, defense and health points) so CP is just a number, a result of a formula.

Now, in terms of taking a gym or doing a raid that’s important is not only atk stat but moveset. Kyogre is strong because of atk stat and good moves, kingler has the edge in damage because of the move crabhammer, but it is quite frail (defense and stamina not so good).

There are plenty of calculators, and a lot of people can explain this better than me, but my advice is just for now focus on getting resources and leveling up, with some high CP crabhammer kinglers caught and evolved from the wild you’ll be fine

Don’t let CP foolish you. Slaking has the highest CP in the game, but is one of the biggest jokes in both PvE and PvP. Moveset is far more important than CP, or stats.
Just take your water type example, at the same level, Kyogre has the highest CP, followed by Gyarados, while Kingler’s is the lowest. For attack stats, the order is Kyogre > Kingler > Gyarados. However, when movesets come into play, Kingler hits the hardest by dealing the highest damage per second (DPS) thanks to the powerful combination of Bubble and Crabhammer. Kyogre has much bulk so can deal the highest total damage output (TDO), but its moveset is just okay. Gyarados is far inferior to those two, because it has neither Kyogre’s titanic stats, nor Kingler’s overpowered moveset. Don’t power up Gyarados for PvE use.
The other top tier water attackers are starters with Hydro Cannon, which is even more powerful than Crabhammer, so despite their CP and attack stats are much below Gyarados’, they can outclass it in most situations.


The strength of Kyogre vs. Kingler vs. Gyarados isn’t strictly by CP. Below is from GamePress’s DPS/TDO spreadsheet. Based on the filters I put in - double water moveset, no shadows, no megas, no primals - you can see some of the top ranking Pokemon. I didn’t choose a particular raid boss so these rankings are strictly based on the stats of the Pokemon and the moveset. Ignore Ash Greninja and Inteleon, they aren’t in the game yet but GamePress added them to the database. All of the values assume a 100 IV Pokemon

The DPS stat is strictly the amount of damage the Pokemon can dish out. A Kingler at 2829 CP with Bubble and Crabhammer will deal more damage than a Kyogre at 4115 CP with Waterfall and Surf. This is because Kingler has a higher base attack stat than Kyogre.

The TDO stat (Total Damage Output) is the amount of damage the Pokemon can dish out before fainting. Kyogre has a higher base defense and stamina stat than Kingler so it will last longer in a fight.

DPS^3*TDO is a combination of DPS and TDO. This value is considered a better approximation of how a Pokemon will perform in a PvE setting.

All of that said, if it is easier for you to power up a Kingler or a Gyarados use whatever you want. Moveset and typing is more important in a PvE setting than CP and stats. If a raid boss needs 4 people minimum to take down and you usually have 5+ people, just use Pokemon with good typing and good moves.

If you were to use a Pokemon like Kingler, a high attack low defense/stamina Pokemon (Gengar is another example) make sure they’re the first Pokemon in your party. When you start a raid battle the boss has 0 energy so you’re only getting hit by fast moves. If you were to use Kingler is a different slot, it might get hit by a charge move as soon as it enters the fight and faints immediately.

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Very good explanation. Just a minor remind: Kingler has lower base attack than Kyogre (240 vs 270).

So, the essence: Gyarados and kingler are both very good water attackers (if they have the corresponding best moves). Kingler dealing a bit more damage, Gyarados bulkier. Your Kyogre is currently not nearly as good, but will be once at > 3200 or so.
However, powering up kingler further doesn’t get it much better, levelling up from e.g. lvl 38 to 40 or so gives you maybe one or two seconds in a big raid (if at all)

I don’t think I need to cover any of the main points which are done admirably above. Your comments about what I’d easier to invest in are common ones. Something I say a lot is that this is a game of resource management as much as anything.

So, fairly simple advice but don’t necessarily look to what you can build now that’s a bit better, but what you might be able to build later. In PvE you really only need, at most, 12 of each type. Building 9 Kinglers, 7 Gyarados and 6 Swampert over the course of incrementally improving your teams doesn’t make long term sense. Ultimately, your theoretical best team of 6 at this moment is perhaps one or two Shadow Swampert/Kingler backed by 4/5 Kyogre.

Perfect world, you’d only expend 6x150k dust or so (or even less if you get lucky trades) to get your best team of 6. Obviously that’s not possible because you need teams for now.

So, ploughing 50k dust or more into levelling up that third kingler from L34 to L37 because you can might help a little right now,but not really and in the long run that’s 50k dust that could go into your Kyogre once you get the candy.

Using weather boosted, any-IV-will-do stuff is the tried and tested way to fill gaps in your team early doors. Last weekend’s CD was a perfect example, 6 HC Samurott would be entirely acceptable options until you get the top DPS counters. Then invest into what will be your likely final 6-12 over time. Lucky trades and purified pokemon are also very efficient ways to build teams.

Also look at dual use pokemon, either in terms of dual types like Mamoswine or Rhyperior or those that can be PvE and PvP, master League speaks for itself but a swampert, venusaur or machamp at the UL cap will still do very well in PvE.

The age-old advice is only power up what you need, when you need it. Pokebattler is great for working out the best counters and whether investing in a counter will yield a significant improvement.

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