How to Counter ASC!Fjorm and F!Edel

[Luzifer]

My question is as stated in the title, how do you guys counter Ascended Fjorm and Fallen Edelgard?
I used to run Duo Byleth for multiple benefits (Desperation, no counter etc.) but Ascended Fjorm just takes her out at this stage and I can’t decide what to run… my team consists of NY!Reginn, NY!Dragr, Bow Legjarn, L!Azura so far… I made some battle simulations and I could swap L!Azura for Flying Ishtar to clear ASC!Fjorm, but I still look for a possible compilation to take both threats out… to be able to move after pretty much any action seems to be key to Summoner Battles at this stage and I feel like the NY banner was designed for mostly that purpose… still my main problems reside with ASC! Fjorm and F!Edelgard.

Thanks for your help/ advice guys!

[_Help_Me]

My advice?

Well, that aside, B!Eirika. Kills most F!Edels dead, and probably can kill Fjorm too.

Fjorm really can’t be killed by range, but isn’t too dangerous up close.

For F!Edel, using a windsweep+NFU user is a great way to kill her.

[Lippi391]

@_Help_Me

For F!Edel, using a windsweep+NFU user is a great way to kill her.

L!Lyn is quite exceptional in this role

[_Help_Me]

Don’t I know it. Was one of my major MVPs for summoner duels. Everyone underestimate her, and doesn’t expect how deadly she can be

[Luzifer]

Windsweep Duo Byleth was in my team for just that purpose, but wasn’t quite enough
I’m considering worst case matchups here… let’s say you have an ASC!Fjorm with any kind of distant safe on her and another tank with any kind of near safe on it, both being in the other one’s safe distance… what do you do?
The only way is to have an immediate answer to any one of the two is to win an engagement in the fight they don’t proc the save ability… and I can’t see B!Eirika win a battle against a built up close melee tank

[Luzifer]

I was thinking of Lilina etc. but haven’t done any simulations yet… might take me some time to come up with solution myself , if nobody knows a quick solution… if I have any intel on hard counter builds against both, I’ll post it as well

[CohTahSoa]

@Luzifer

I can’t see B!Eirika win a battle against a built up close melee tank

The truth can be surprising

[VivatVeritas]

This is terrifying

[_Help_Me]

You are much more likely to win the up close battle than the far one. Fjorm is extremely difficult to kill, thanks to her PRF special.

Meanwhile, a well built Eirika can kill while doing 0x2 damage, so there’s that. But in all seriousness, far save fjorm is a very difficult to kill beast, and I would rather kill melee first.

[Luzifer]

I see what you mean, but that’s just an example of someone running Gustav as the close guard untit… unfortunately B!Eirika doesn’t win against all viable options for that slot

[Luzifer]

I’ll have to do some testing, to see which close combat unit can win the matchups here, but I think you’re right with the general Idea of going close first

[VivatVeritas]

Did some calcs and Eirika can also defeat most Ardens and P!Surtrs. Those three are going to be 95% of what you fight.

[_Help_Me]

Gustav is an absolute tank who she loses the WTA to. The point being that if she can beat him, she isn’t likely to be losing to many other threats.

@Thehalohedgehog is the B!Eirika expert, but fully invested she’s one of the best armor killers in the game (also just one of the best units in the game).

[probablymothman]

A few people have mentioned B!Eirika and she is an absolute monster, but if you have him, B!Alm also tears through both of them no problem (and also doesn’t have to worry about counters, though B!Eirika isn’t too concerned in that department either tbh)

[CohTahSoa]

The threats to her are:

1. Instant specials, which can kill her even through DR, but they need to do a lot of damage
2. Brave Edel, who gets 80% DR on the second hit, which is the big one.

I haven’t run all the matchups, but I don’t think any armors can tank her without one of these.
Null armor effectiveness as well, but they still have to be green and stupid bulky to live.

[Luzifer]

Yeah, to be honst, B!Edel was one of the close safe enemies I tested B!Eirika against and she lost

[ShinxDaSphinx]

I want to point out BEliwood for being an extremely efficient and cheap counter to FEdel if you have him from a CYL pick or a pitybreaker
all that really matters for him is having Windsweep

I went off to find the beefiest FEdel I could find (this one has extra Def and HP from blessings, is fully whaled, etc.)

(sorry seiken lol)
he fares extremely well against virtually any FEdel build and something like this should get through almost any one that isn’t on a defense tile

[Luzifer]

I just did this simulation?

[CohTahSoa]

Brave Eirika really is the best near save buster out there, there’s just those few units who beat her anyway. If you don’t have or want to use her, ranged AOE spammers (L!lina, Yuri, Ophelia, anyone with high attack if you’ve got the fodder) can get around Ice Mirror and kill Fjorm.

Edelgard is vulnerable to effective damage (Hapi, B!Eliwood, any armor killer), NFU/forced doubles (the L!Byleths, most modern speedy swords), and AOE (see above).

And of course there are the usual f2p suspects for Fallen Edelgard

[Luzifer]

Sorry, my simulation was pointless… forgot to actiave the actual far safe ability xD