Is Caster Cu really that bad?

If you happen to have his NP on 3+

Cuz I kinda get the feeling the overal opinion on him is fairly ‘meh’
And while his kit is very all over the place, it still has a lot of things in it:
-The best self survival skill in the game
-Debuff cleanse
-Np battery (30%) with a high uptime crit/debuff resist
-Upgraded AoE NP with def down (and 20% buster up, for if you are able to get one off again)
-Very high base Np gain to counter the low hitrate (especially nice for his 3 hit extra)

Ofc listing it like this makes it seem he’s super good, but I can also see his lack of real damage steriod, overall low atk, low star weight, no refund on the NP ect, ect.

So if you were to try and make him work, how’d you do it?
Or do you think he really isn’t worth investing in?

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Sadly not worth investing in. He suffers from serious Jack-of-All-Trades syndrome; his kit is a junk drawer of poorly related effects, and he’s a 3* Buster NP Caster on top of it.

Even if his kit worked well, his class and base stat combination would be limiting. As it is, there’s no compelling reason to take him anywhere, because he doesn’t hit hard enough for a point Servant and doesn’t support his team in a significant capacity, so his self defensive utility isn’t highly valued.

Well, depend on the alternative really.
Who do you have? Shakespeare? Babbage?
Well Babbage is fine I guess.
There is nothing wrong per se with caster cu, and he is perfectly serviceable if you want to use him.
It’s just thet there are a ton on alternative in higher rarity who replace him, and if you have played long enought, odds are you have an Helena or something, who is going to be a better overall investment.

But he is fine

The problem is partially that he’s storylocked and that caster class has lots of competition. I’ve been playing over 850 days and only just got him np leveled up on the cbc/class banners while trying to get waver. But in the mean time, I’ve already got paracelsus max skilled and now avicebron, not to mention Helena, Nitocris, and DaVinci in higher rarity, all with bigger batteries and most with at least guts for survival.

Doesn’t help that with developed rosters, 3T strategies makes survivability obsolete much of the time.

Any further leveling CasCu gets from me will be for character loyalty more than gameplay. And I still might, I do like cu.

Honestly this is kinda how I feel.
Like, I prefer it if the servant is strong but I’m also the guy who has Sasaki to almost 90 and Saber Gilles at 80

I’ve got Sasaki at 80 myself… But gilles? He has appeal? Like at all?

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Gilles saber is awesome.

3 Likes

Fixed it for you

I’m not a big fan of stalkers.

3 Likes

Oh no character wise he is bland and boring. Caster gil is more funny.
But he have the coolest armor in the game, and is a very interesting servant to use.
Good? Well he need a lot of work to be fine at best, but yeah

He’s got utility for staying around, yes, in between his PFA and debuff cleanse, but yes due to no steroids his damage is absolutely baked potato and you’re better off using Babbage if you want a budget Caster DPS (who is quite slept on IMO). He survives first, does damage second.

I don’t think “can you use make X work?” is ever really the right question. I think with enough effort, you can make any Servant work.

The better question is “why would you want to?” In a case like Cas Cu, why would you want to put the effort into making Cas Cu work when there are just better options all around, even just in his rarity (possibly even lower rarity).

Now, if the answer to that question is “because I like X,” then that’s all you really need to know.

6 Likes

I like his design

As for gameplay, his buster crits will hit extremely well and it’s not hard to charge his NP.
And his synergy with Merlin is on point.
Buuuuut the fact that his atk up is only 2 turns, he can’t buster brave chain and his np giving damage in exchange for not dealing damage itself. It all just comes down to an oof.

Sasaki while sub optimal is one of the best scalers with grails I feel. Like his kit is amazing, but he really needs that atk stat. The NP interlute does feel like it helps him a lot

I don’t think he’s particularly bad at all. Sure, there’s some favoritism speaking there, but if you get him to NP5 and get the NP upgrade then he should perform pretty well.

A typical critique is that he has a crit skill but has caster star weight, but this is also something that won’t matter too much if you have him in a team that either has similar low star weights or floods the field with enough stars or has a support skill that gives him more star weight.
In general people seem to take star weight too seriously, as if there’s no point unless you can guarantee they will crit every time. The crit system has some randomness to it, either flood the field with stars or accept that sometimes you will not crit when you have a high chance to and other times you will when you have a low chance. That’s just how it’s designed, either enjoy the system as is or cheat it via 2030 CEs :fgo_moriartysmile:

As for damage, aside from the crits I covered above, his NP got upgraded to not only have more damage, but also give a 3 turn Buster buff, so you can make use of that to either charge up your NP again to hit even harder on that third turn or simply make your buster cards hit harder when attacking regularly. Either way, having a buff of this sort tied to a caster NP means he can activate it pretty often.

Disengage is kind of the weak link here, but we haven’t had any buffs to that skill line yet, so who knows if/when that’ll happen, but it would be nice to get another effect from that.

Otherwise he just really needs an animation update. This guy is literally at the top of my list of servants that most need animation updates (yes, there’s a thread about that, you can check it out if you want) since he showed off quality animations in the FGO anime.

A friend of mine has him at level 90, so he definitely has fans out there. At least he’s not his caster version, some people like the whole conflicted/depressed thing he has going on because he knows what he became in the past and can’t change it. Also unlimited buster works is pretty fun.
He needs some buffs, but still pretty fun in his current form.

presses x to doubt
I do appreciate his cool armor, but there’s a lot of cool armor in the game. Remember, third ascension Mori Nagayoshi will be here eventually… and then there’s already the Artoria Lancer’s first ascensions and Mordred’s armor.

2 Likes

I do like disengage as a skill, it’s a neat short CD debuff remove.
Maybe not the best on Cu, but as a skill I like it.

He has to crit first, which can be a problem with Caster star weight. He has no skills for manipulating star absorption, so you have to flood the field or use other tools just to help him crit more consistently.

In the end you’re making a big effort just to enable an “okay” Servant to function at his fullest potential while he has competition that will perform at least well with only a half-assed support system. Only worth it if you love him and really want to make him work.

My only issue with it is the heal is very minimal (considering other skills out there with debuff removal), but the debuff removal is nice.

Comparisons

Disengage: 1500 to 2500 heal at max depending on rank, cooldown of 7

Others with a 7 turn cooldown
Grace of the Sky God B: remove debuffs and Guts for 2000 heath (3 turns)
I Will Not Go Home Yet! B++: remove debuffs and increase max health by 2000 for 3 turns
Medicine A+: 3000 targetable heal and remove debuffs
Self-Suggestion: remove debuffs and 100% debuff resist for 3 turns
Flame-Colored Kiss A: remove debuffs and 30% buster buff for 1 turn
Protection From Tathagata B: remove debuffs and increase star gather rate by 500% for 1 turn
Contradictory Mentality A: remove debuffs and increase NP gain by 50% for 3 turns
Magecraft Release A: targetable remove debuffs and 20% NP charge
Destruction Announcement: remove debuffs and increase NP gauge by 20% per turn for 3 turns

And then there’s BB’s skill at a 6 turn cooldown, but I’ll give her that because she’s BB.
At 8 turn cooldown the added effects are even greater, so I think that Disengage should have some form of buff, even if just a slight one like increasing the heal.

I’ll kindly disagree with this, especially if this particular facet of your argument relies on “Just roll SSR gacha CEs,” when I’ve lost track of how many people out there are JP vets and still asking for e.g. a single scope, or the amount of times I’ve personally been dismayed at my nth Formal Craft or w/e instead of BG/Scope. Support Merlin is a fairer one that you can reliably take out even at a budget level, but otherwise his lack of star pull does mean that, say, getting those Arts crits for the next WICKAHMAN isn’t necessarily that reliable.
Star bombing, certainly. Alt lacks the multiple Carps my main has, but we get Carp-likes with enough reliability that even if you missed the first you will be able to make use of that strat in time for burst turns.

I think star weight is plenty worth considering seriously, especially if we’re talking an awkward durable DPS type with no star pull.

Granted, Mozart exists, but there are so many others I’d sooner make use of his kit with than him: Mori, Lu Bu, Caesar, Bedivere (especially, fairly, assuming NP5 SL Rs), Leonidas even in some cases, Spartacus and Eric and Caligula, Asterios. Or, well, Paracelsus and Avicebron and Babbage. As a DPS, he needs some more (or you can go full undying lol and give him an added form of resiliency against debuffs in some for of Debuff Immunity to his Disengage).

This though is “Literally just take Bryn or way later, Jane,” both of whom would be coming at the expense of a support Merlin/Waver/Skadi/HCA/Mozart/etc. Alternatively, “Use Brand, Tropical Summer, or 2004,” but 2004 is at least pretty great.

Also worth pointing out that that is still “Not much better than Para or Avicebron”-tier assuming you do make the effort to NP5 him in the first place, both of whom have more utility… although an argument can nonetheless still be made for Cu in low-rarity terms simply because charge + PFA + debuff cleanse is a handy combo for not-freaking-dying.
Yes, it’s better than no upgrade, but the damage is still actually laughable.

Yeah, you really can’t discount star weight. Consistency is highly valued in gameplay, and low star weight without a reliable method to improve it is a handicap no matter how you look at it.

Even worse, Servants who start with low star weight need an even higher multiplier to achieve the kind of consistency that Riders enjoy just by existing.

A good example is Karna: he’s a powerful Servant with high face card damage and a potent 3T crit buff, but he has to deal with a low star weight while not being quite good enough at star gen to make his crits constant without help.

Now look at CasCu, with even lower star weight, who doesn’t have the benefit of hitting like a truck by default and who needs crits while his buffs are active just to deal reasonable damage.

I was trying to put more emphasis on ‘just accept the system as it is and prepare for it reasonably rather than just writing off characters due to low star weight’, but fair enough. There are similar CEs via star bombs like you pointed out and other star per turn CEs that give less stars I should’ve brought up there.

Another option is to pair him with assassins, they produce stars and have low star weight, that’s a good combo. This is what I was talking about for using him with others that have low star weight. Assassins, casters, berserkers, etc. As long as you don’t pair him with two riders he’ll still have some chance to crit, but the lower star rate his allies have the better the chances. Personally I don’t mind the unpredictability of pairing him with characters that have higher star rate like the knight trio, but of course his rates are going to be better with the ones I mentioned earlier.

Huh, I thought there were more of these out there. I guess there’s some Mystic Codes, but that won’t be as consistent. So fair enough there, didn’t do my research. Doesn’t Jason have one as well? Still a long ways off though.

Another example, Li Shuwen. Low star weight but has a star gather skill. Was using him for a first time in jttw, along with David for drop bonus and penth. Even when I got a semi decent pile of stars off a brave chain…even the star gather skill couldn’t overcome the low starweight vs archer, even at level 9. It was so frustrating that I finally moved David to the back and sanzang to the front so I could actually get a crit out of my crit servant.

CasCu has half the starweight of li, so I wouldn’t plan on exploiting crit damage with him without significant star flooding, unless only team members were zerkers or something…

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