Lancelot v Edmond Dantes

As we approach the release of Skadi we are are seeing more and more questions regarding her, DSS and her impact on the meta.

There are a few Servants who come to mind when we think of who benefits but I wanted to ask about 2 specifically, that being Lancelot and Edmond Dantes.

Lancelot is an SR Berserker and therefore will hit with x1.5 damage to most enemies while Dantes is an SSR Avenger and will hit with neutral damage to most enemies.

So putting them side by side, how do they compare? If you have one of them, is it worth rolling for the other? Does having 1 at a certain NP level invalidate the other? Do they both have uses irrespective of their NP levels? How does their NP damage compare to each other? Do other factors like NP gain/refund factor in?

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Dantes is regarded as the gold standard for quick looping. This is because he has respectable damage (becing able to hit common damage benchmarks) as well as very stable refund ( being loopable on assassins and zerks, not requiring MLB scope or waver to start a loop, having a lower refund threshold of 46% because avenger passives).

Lancelot being beserker class means he too is a competent omnifarmer ( barring zerks and sometimes assassins depending on scripts) . Lancelots loop stability is worse than Dantes because his stable scripts rely on waver / MLB scope. There are scripts that do without ( 50% starting charge + plugsuit para) but these are very overkill reliant.

Damage wise we’ll assume their optimal comp on W3 (superscope + 2004) .

NP 1 140K (L) vs 160k( D)
NP 2 186k vs 200k
NP3 200k vs 220K
NP 4 220k vs 230k
NP 5 230k vs 240k

Damage wise if you have NP 2 + Lancelot the case for Dantes becomes alot weaker, the only advantage that Dantes has is zerk looping but if you have Parv or Valk to handle zerks then that point is also moot

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Your counting the NP upgrade that Dante will have?

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What is different about Dantes which means he doesn’t require MLB scope or Waver?

Maybe his 3 turn 50% NP gain or maybe his high damage or even a better natural NP gain

If you have the choice, go for Dantes.
Dantes and Lancelot have similar damage output but Dantes is a much much more reliable NP looper and with one more quick card he’s a far superior choice for dealing with CQ by allowing wider range of 3rd and 4th support hence opening more versatile comps.

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Considering that Lancelot can go from 0 to 100% on certain conditions. Couldn’t he be better for certain nodes with 2 enemies on 2nd wave or something like that?

Besides that, Edmond is overall better, he even has invul pen to laugh at gimmicks and he has less of a glass jaw. He needs overkill to loop Berserkers but that’s isn’t hard to do being an avenger with high ATK and stuff.

Valkyrie and Parvati are also up there, but their low atk stat really screws them over against anything that isn’t an Archer or an Berserker.

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What makes assassins and berserkers an outlier? Lancelot being a berserker himself, shouldn’t damage be relatively equal across all classes except foreigners?

They give less np gauge on hit compared to the other classes making looping harder

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Assassin and Zerks have lower NP refund. Additionally , zerks do 1.5 x to other zerks, while every other class does 2x to zerks, which means its actually harder for Lancelot to clock the overkill he needs relative to other loopers because he’s not getting the full class advantage.

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Lancelot and Dantes can both handle nodes with a 3/2/X composition but they’ll both ask for MLB scope + 2004. So with regards to looping on just 2 enemies they are still pretty comparable.

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I learn things every day. Thank you!

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Is it impossible to skadi loop for Dantes/Zerklot without 2004 MC?
I only have one Kscope, but I have Waver and more alternative NP charger servant.

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2004 with Superscope is considered to be their most optimal composition (because it is plugless and offers the highest w3 damage) but there are other scripts. Yes Dantes and Lancelot can do without 2004 provided you have waver.

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So I have an NP2 Lancelot and was wondering whether to skip Dantes or not. I quite like his design and after reading all this I’m still not sure what to do. I have a fair few targets over the summer months already, I guess we’ll see…

Thanks for the info everyone :smiley:

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Generally, if you have a MLB K-scope CE, then you don’t need Dantes. Lancelot will get the job done as long as you have your 2004 MC maxed out (which isn’t very hard to do.)

However, if you don’t have a MLB K-scope, try for Dantes. Even at NP1 I have yet to see a quest he can’t 3 turn (provided the first two waves have 3 enemies.) Depending on the class of the enemies and the amount of HP they have, it can be a bit tricky, but I can always make it work. It’s the third wave that usually makes or breaks the 3-turn loop. The boss of the quest almost always needs command cards to be taken care of, but if you get one of Dantes’ quick cards on that third wave, you’re golden. And if you don’t, you can use the card shuffle (since this scenario most likely has you using the Mage’s Association Uniform.)

Unfortunately, I don’t know if Lancelot can be that picky with looping because, unfortunately, I don’t have a MLB K-scope on either account, so I haven’t used him as extensively as I have Dantes.

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Wait :fgo_grampsnani:?! How is that even possible?! Are you telling me that if I have a wave with an Assassin, an Archer and a Berserker (hypothetically speaking) then I am screwed where NP gain is concerned?! How is that even possible? That means if I have an all Assassin or Berserker node then I might as well give up on looping by that logic, right? Why are they so special?

Does anyone know if his rate up is before or after Summer BB’s?

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I don’t understand. Why is everyone suggesting an MLB Kscope CE? Is it so that Waver can give him +50% NP battery on Turn 2 or other to act as a bonus to his NP refund after he NPs?

Simply for damage and time. If you do not have mlb kscope, you need to use waver skill for thet 20%. If you do it, you need to use plug suit, and him.
If you don’t, you can use fragment of 2004, in w2 you can use thet mystic code np up for more loop potential, and the np damage up for even more damage on w3.
So more damage, more stable loop, less click/ time

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