Líf/Thrasir Prf misleading text

[kakyoin01]

Just started training up Líf, and of course dealing with his ally recoil damage sword is a bit annoying. However, after Sökkvabekkr damaged two equidistant allies I reexamined the effect text:

“If unit is within 3 spaces of an ally, grants Atk/Spd/Def/Res +4 during combat, and unit makes a guaranteed follow-up attack, but after combat, if unit attacked, deals 20 damage to nearest ally.”

Thrasir’s Ífingr has similar phrasing, referencing “ally” rather than multiple “allies” which can be impacted by a similar position-based self-buff. I know from experience with this weapon as well that her debuff applies to all equidistant allies as well. This singular phrasing seems misleading. I combed through other similar Prf effects such as NY!Gunnthrá’s Hikami, all of the Sabotage effects from heroes like B!Micaiah, Yune and NY!Anna, and all of the ‘more/less allies than foes’ position-based Prf effects (B!Alm, L!Hector, etc). They correctly use plural phrasing (“allies” and “foes”) for multiple unit subjectivity and singular phrasing (“foe’s”) for individual unit subjectivity, respectively.

Obviously everyone with any reasonable investment in FEH already knows what Ífingr and Sökkvabekkr do in detail, but the misleading text on these two Prfs bothers me, it could mislead newer players less familiar with the game. Tempted to write in to have them adjusted for more accuracy going forward.

[geardagas]

Maybe you can get us some orbs out of this.

[Mysterym1ster]

Yay IS for having bad descriptions

[Lain]

Its not misleading at all.
If you’ve two allies in the same range for his weapon its obvious that both of them eat damage since they’re both the nearest ally.
Even a new player would know.

[TMFM]

Pretty much what Lain said. If you have multiple nearest allies the damage/debuff will hit all of them. Pretty simple to understand imo.

[kakyoin01]

Perhaps the better term is “inconsistent.” Which is undoubtedly true. I’ll be writing in to IS about it either way.

[Lain]

Its also not “inconsistent", the effects of the examples of you (B!Alm and L!Hector) really depent on how many allies or foes are there for activating the effects.
Meanwhile Lifs and Thrasirs effects actually only need one ally, but can activate also when more allies are in the same range which makes total sense.
I fail to see wheres the problem.

[kakyoin01]

NY!Gunnthrá’s effect targets multiple foes within the target range. The skill says “foes” to indicate multi-targeting. Líf and Thrasir weapons state “ally” to incorrectly indicate multi-targeting when they should state “allies”. This is incorrect and inconsistent wth how those skills work. I don’t see how the current phrasing is defendable.

[Lain]

No its not, if it says “allies” instead of “ally” then people will assume that the effect only will work when more allies are in range which is wrong.

[kakyoin01]

I see where the misunderstanding is coming from. I am particularly focused on the last part of the skill description: “to closest ally”. It should be “closest allies” since multiple allies can be affected by the recoil or debuff.

[Z-Man]

@kakyoin01 I mean that’s the same way opening skills work for the “ally with highest x stat”, how gap skills work for the “ally with highest x + y stat total”, and how chills work for the “foe with highest x stat”. If multiple units meet the requirement, they all get it. I don’t know why that would confuse or surprise you. Nobody complained about those descriptions so why are Líf and Thrasir so special?

[TMFM]

Logically, it would always affect multiple allies if they fulfill the same conditions. How else would it work? Random targeting?

[Lain]

@kakyoin01

It should be “closest allies” since multiple allies can be affected by the recoil or debuff.

Not, because the multiple allies only occures when both allies are in the same range.
If one ally is one space away and the other two, but are in the range of the weapon only the ally whos away one space is getting the damage.
Its totally right.

[Lain]

Here a example:

The Marth under him is the nearest ally

He gets the damage:

Both Marths are in the same range, both get the damage:

If you would change the wording to “allies” instead of “ally” in the first picture the second Marth should also get damaged, but thats not how the effect works.

[kakyoin01]

That only further proves the phrasing isn’t consistent, I think. “Same range” isn’t outright stated, it has to be assumed. The skill could use further clarification to indicate the recoil applies to all allies equidistant from Líf that are closest to him.

[Z-Man]

The harder they try to clarify that the clunkier the description would be. It makes sense the way its worded and even if you somehow couldn’t read it’s still a mistake you’d only make once. It’s not an inconsistency(as I pointed its worded the same way as other skills with similar activation requirements), and it certainly isn’t as big a deal as you’re making it out to be

[Z-Man]

Oh and its wording and function are EXACTLY the same as fallen berkut who has been in the game for how long at this point?

[Lain]

Eh I’m out, think what you want I’ve given you enough proof that the wording is fine as it is.
Good luck with your feedback, I’m pretty sure they’ll read it.

[kakyoin01]

I am not making it out to be a big deal. Please don’t sharpen my narrative. I am pointing out something I think could use further clarification because 20 recoil damage is a big deal, a mistake one wouldn’t want to make. And my opinion can be swayed on this, I don’t have to be right. You make some good points on the phrasing.

[kakyoin01]

You made great points in favor of leaving the text as-is, thanks. Just because you come off strong at times doesn’t mean your thoughts shouldn’t be considered. I can see why they could keep the text unchanged as well.