Regarding OC's in this fandom

Hello!
I wasn’t sure if I selected the right tag, but I’m only here for this one question. As I don’t play the Game myself I’ll probably delete this account afterwards (or just leave it on the side depending on how much attention this recieves).
I was first thinking about asking this on reddit but I feel like I wouldn’t get an answer over there so I hope it’s fine to ask this here instead.

To cut right to it: I’ve had a discussion with some friends about OC’s and we ended up on OC’s in Fate/Grand Order because both of them play it. One of them has an OC - they’re not there to replace the MC but rather as someone who plays a role below them (I didn’t ask about the specifics but that’s unimportant for this).

We searched on the internet for a bit but couldn’t find many people who used OC’s and the few who actually posted about them were from 2016/17 so I’ve been wondering if this is because the main character is already written to be a self-insert or for another reason. I have read about some fandoms being cricital towards peoples OC’s - mind you I don’t mean to offend anyone here if it sounds like it - so I’ve been thinking that maybe people just don’t want to be too open about their OC’s.

I feel like people normally jump straight towards making an OC - especially when the story is allowing it (even if it’s only barely plausible) and from what I’ve seen there are enough possibilities and ways to integrate an OC into the story, yet there is almost nothing.

I’m not too sure about my grammar so I might have misspelled some words and used them repeatedly (my explanation is probably somewhat confusing), but I hope it’s understandable.

I would say pretty much a combination of what you said. The MC is already a self-insert, and all the feasible important roles are already taken (by some usually generally likable characters mind you).

Now, I’ve never really been a big fan of ocs myself, unless the game or media directly supports it (and even then most of the time it still doesn’t feel like an oc. Take Mass Effect’s Shepard for instance). A big big reason for this though it’s because it’s almost never done well: 90% or more ocs I see are blatant self inserts, Mary Sue’s, and/or outright replace existing characters, whether figuratively (in the narrative) or literally.

But that’s always been me, regardless of the fandom and I really don’t know the general consensus is.
But, I think I’m of the opposite opinion of you, that the game does not have space for an Oc, because either the OC is even more of a nobody than the mc and also basically powerless (like the one oc that you did mention), or it completely destroys the entire narrative just by existing. Or else you’re making a servant theory, but since servants are famous people by definition, that’s not really an oc in the first place.

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The thing is that just like @MetallicD3ath mentioned - it’s kind of hard to pull it of correctly because an OC in this game can completly destroy the dynamic and story perspective so you’d have to be really careful with how you go through with it (backstory, role in the story etc.)

If someone decides to make their OC public then they will prob. have to deal with some backlash (depending on the role they gave them) but I think it can potentially work if you find a acceptable way of putting them in there while not destroying the story perspective.

So this is my personal view but if it answers your question then I'll make my anxiety worse and potentially humiliate myself for a sec.

I’ve been thinking about making an OC myself - no elaboration to keep this short but basically; it wouldn’t be a self-insert, more a supporting character who has no real story impact except for a few rare events at best - because I feel kind of uncomfortable with using Gudako as an self-insert. This comes mainly because of the fact that they’re a minor for most the game and having servants crush on them just doesn’t sit right with me (I mean I’m not going against people’s ships, you do you. I have no right to question things with my salieri fangirling).

For example, can we talk about summer tamamos questionable valentine’s event?

Please don’t murder me I like breathing

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I initially thought the question was more directed towards Fanfics and the sort, which would make more sense. I mean, the game only lets you pick the main character’s name (which you can change anytime in the menu), Gender (which you can ALSO change anytime in the menu) and the Mystic Code/Costume (only viewable in the menu and after combat, only effects during combat since you can’t see the player in the story). Choices in the story are useless since most of the time they don’t even impact the dialogue ahead and only two/three times in the entire game they impact the kind of enemy/ies you fight next.

Hidden because rant, I guess? Doesn't really answer the question so don't really read it, I'm just venting.

To be fair, as much of a self-insert they tried to make the Master in FGO, it’s worthless. You might as well not have choices, since they don’t impact in any way in the story cutscenes. You even have that stupid trend where you are FORCED to choose only one option as if there were any need for the Main Character to speak overtly. It could just be described in the first/third person and it would achieve the same effect. After all, none of the scenes are voiced.

In fact, the only choices that actually matter are I think two or three in the entire game, because they pick different enemies to fight for a couple of fights. One of them being a hard boss or an EVEN HARDER BOSS (I’m looking at you Babylonia Singularity).

I do understand that this is to keep the “visual novel feel” since the franchise started with the now popular and worldwide-known eroge Fate/Stay Night. But oh well, we’re 5 years deep into the game now (in JP, at least) so nobody cares about my stupid rant.

Have a cute emoji instead :fgo_meltstash:

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Well Gudao is a ultimate self insert with no background in Magecraft so any OCs should have a well established background to make an interesting story. The lore in FGO is massive which is nice but also a pain in the ass to keep track of. As the last master, Gudao is forced to fight way beyond his league and barely won because he/she’s not a threat. In a way he/she represents humanity’s unwillingness to die even in overwhelming odds. If OCs are stronger than Gudao they will be targeted early on, and there is no muggle in Chaldea save Gudao.

I’m not exactly sure what your friends are doing, but gudao as a self-insert character and all the tropes that come with it is in my opinion the worst thing the writers could have done for a story centric game like fgo.

You could literally take anyone else that appeared so far in fgo, put them in the shoes of our main character and write a way more entertaining story. Because even as a self insert, gudao fails, since the choices you are given don’t even matter.

I do think the writers noticed that flaw, the mc starts to show more character starting from later story arcs. He still is absolutely bland though.

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I think their treatment of the MC is intentional, as the primary narrative focus should be on the servants. They are, after all, the characters you collect and empower.

There’s always a compromise in a game between narrative and mechanics. Some games skew more in one direction than the other (think visual novel vs platformer), but in all cases, both must serve the game’s primary engagement. FGO has visual novel elements, but unlike Fate/Stay Night, it isn’t primarily about the story. FGO is mostly about collecting and raising servants, and the story is there to contextualize them and develop their characters.

To be clear, I am not saying the story is unimportant, it’s one of my favorite parts of the game, but it’s not the main driver of engagement with the game. To that end, developing the main character’s personality is counterproductive, because it wastes time on a character you can neither level up, nor use in battle. There’s only so much text you can put in between fights before players start skipping it, so you have to make it count. It’s a much better use of their limited resources to invest that resource into the servants, not the MC.

This is also why I hypothesize there isn’t much prevalence of OCs in FGO: when the game is about collecting characters, there’s no room for your own character whom you can’t actually use.

Yeah, their design choice for the mc was obviously deliberate. It is also only a failure in my eyes, not for the game or the creators obviously.

I started fgo because I enjoyed earlier entries like fate ubw and especially fate zero. So the story is by far the biggest motivator for me to keep playing. The gameplay is fun and getting a cool servant in the gacha is a nice bonus, but it is not the most important thing, at least for me.

That’s why I personally don’t like the way our mc is designed. I believe there would have been so much potential for an even more intricate and engaging story, but I understand the reasoning behind it.
That said, I’m looking forward to lostbelt 3, which is apparently written by urobuchi, who also was responsible for fate zero.

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I feel like it’s important to make a distinction between “it’s a failure” and “It’s not a choice that appeals to me.” After all, you did say that you understand the reasons the choice was made, and it seems to be working quite successfully, if FGO’s sales numbers are any indication. It just isn’t a choice that appeals to your tastes.

That’s fine, no game can please everyone, as we all have different, and often conflicting, preferences. But I believe it’s important not to label an artistic choices as “mistakes” or “failures” when they are working as intended, even if those intentions aren’t what we personally prefer.

I, for example, don’t care for Shakespeare, but I love Avenue Q. That having been said, I’m not going to call The Tempest a failure because it doesn’t have any puppets in it.

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True, bad choice of words on my part.

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shhh don’t be anxious //pap. I definitely choose to interpret MC as ~20s in fanfic for same reasons that you said :fgo_gudako:

and OP don’t worry seems pretty understandable to me?

My thoughts on this have pretty much already been said by other people in this thread, but I especially tend to think along the lines of The_Cheeseman’s explanation in terms of primary narrative focus being on servants + MetallicD3ath’s point that the MC is already a self-insert/all feasible important roles are taken by likeable characters.

I feel like I rarely see any fanfic that develop any OC/focus on master development except in short-term snapshots, because like Dangonzo said, the game is pretty visual novel-y in that there’s basically one set path and the choices that you make don’t matter beyond slightly different flavor text. You have to have a very specific set of determined characteristics to fit in with this preordained path, if that makes sense at all?

It’s much easier to go into servants since it’s already been confirmed that they’re complex characters that can be vastly different between summonings (e.g. Fate/Apocrypha Avicebron vs. Russian Lostbelt Avicebron).

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everyone on reddit creates oc tho
to the point they literally make no sense and go against every single fate lore
:thonk: