The new Smoke skills are super cheap

[_Help_Me]

First of all, it’s expensive, limited fodder. Not exactly easy to get.

Secondly, as a smoke skill it only takes effect after the first combat, meaning you can still be killed outright before gaining the effects.

Third:

@Gin_Gitsune

And just now, I realise multiple DR stacking really is a thing (I thought it was limited to just Flayn & Vital Astra), so that’s another level of ridiculous.

Always has been, but diminishing returns. So you can do it, but outside of bonkers cases like B!Ike you are usually better running something else.

The smoke skills are good, and I really don’t like the direction they’re taking the game in terms of powercreep, but they aren’t explicitly broken or anything like that.

[Gin_Gitsune]

@_Help_Me

First of all, it’s expensive, limited fodder. Not exactly easy to get.

It’s obvious I’m not saying that. I mean “cheap” as in broken.

@_Help_Me

Secondly, as a smoke skill it only takes effect after the first combat, meaning you can still be killed outright before gaining the effects.

yeah I somehow completely missed that…

@_Help_Me

Always has been, but diminishing returns. So you can do it, but outside of bonkers cases like B!Ike you are usually better running something else.

I’m pretty sure stacking something ridiculous like 50+% is something most would appreciate. ]:

@_Help_Me

but they aren’t explicitly broken or anything like that.

liar

[_Help_Me]

@Gin_Gitsune

It’s obvious I’m not saying that. I mean “cheap” as in broken.

I am aware, but availability is part of how good a skill is

@Gin_Gitsune

I’m pretty sure stacking something ridiculous like 50+% is something most would appreciate. ]:

64% is the most common stacking combo, but its multiplicative, not additive. So say a 60%+40% DR does not equal 100%

@Gin_Gitsune

liar

They’re good, undoubtedly. There is also a lot of counter play to them (atk smoke is countered by NFU, which everyone runs anyway because you pretty much need it; spd smoke is countered by outspeeding them so they get no dodge DR, or DR piercing affects)

Again, very good skill, but also not broken (that would pathfinder)

[Lain]

i dunno nogi bro I personally think Atk Smoke is way more broken tbh
I wish I got more of it, need that shit on alot of units
But Spd Smoke do be bonkers tho you’re right

[Dragginz]

Atk smoke: +13 Def/Res and denial

Spd smoke: +13 Spd and DR

Thing is… Both only work on the most min-maxed units, and they are already busted.

NFU is everywhere so the denial is worthless against units who you’re most scared of, and lulls are becoming popular again so you’re at most getting +7 Def/Res out of it… Just like smoke 3.

+13 Spd swing is great, but again lulls make that 7, and aside from speedlords hitting 80+ on the regular, lethality and deadeye are rampant so 74% DR becomes 0 real quick. And not to mention, to get that DR, you need to outspeed everything by a LARGE margin. So on a unit like Nott or Dagr it’s viable, but on B!Marth? Not so much.

[Thehalohedgehog]

Dude. We already have threads for a lot of these things. You don’t need to make ones for every freaking thing that pops in your head.
Resplendent Faye, already had a thread.

The Next Resplendent Hero is Faye

[chara_img_00001005000120_01] [chara_img_00001005000120_02] [chara_img_00001005000120_03] [chara_img_00001005000120_04] Personally hyped up for once since I got my Faye to plus ten not too long ago. [BlueStacks 4_25_2022 3_04_45 AM (2)]

Discussion on T4 smokes, already has a thread.

Best builds to help smoke the most weed

Smoke 4s are pretty cool. I’ve been looking a bit on how they can be utilized well. As a general basis, units who can’t normally use Dodge or Follow-Block want these skills the most, but that’s not to say units who nornally can don’t want them too From what it seems, some of the best users of Spd Smoke 4 are units who can prevent the foe from counterattacking when initiating by any means. Things like Adept/Despo or Sweep effects. [FeH Unit builder - Naesala - Sky's Shadow] [FeH Unit builder…

You’re bordering on spam at this point and at least to me it’s getting annoying. Actually scratch that, it’s been annoying for a long time. If you just want to generally chat then why not check out the AR-D threads, that’s basically what they’re for nowadays.

AR-D Thread 126: Y!Ike Thanos Snapped and Half of Noodles’ Orbs Vanished

@Z-Man @NpcLucario @your_cat @Zach_Has_Cancer @WierdOne @Gogh @Idunno @argenmendon @The_Hoshidan @Samurai-of-Inferno @Arm_The_Homeless @Reality @PessimistPuglet @Moop @seiken @VivatVeritas @_Help_Me @MissSugarsalt @dimitrisnoodlehair @Almond Did I miss anyone? Anyway most important rule here; [p.i.l.k]

As for T4 smokes themselves, well the thread I just linked has discussed them quite a bit. They’re good and can be very strong but they aren’t without their drawbacks.

[Gin_Gitsune]

@_Help_Me

64% is the most common stacking combo, but its multiplicative, not additive. So say a 60%+40% DR does not equal 100%

That’s still a ton of reduction, and I’m well aware you’re not getting a literal 100%.

shinonfuckyou

I can’t quote that. >:(

[Gin_Gitsune]

@Dragginz

lulls are becoming popular again

When did people stop using them??? I always saw them as great skills.

[ducdai]

Im thinking of slapping the new Atk smoke 4 on my shannan to prevent those cheat followups.

[LadyLuna]

@Gin_Gitsune

When did people stop using them???

Canto became insanely popular so people slapped Traces onto all their cavs, while infantry often leaned towards NFU or Spd DR skills instead

But now people spam Bonus Doubler strats in Summoner Duels so Lulls are gaining traction again

[Gin_Gitsune]

But horses are very specific case, and it’s obvious you’d pick that over Lulls. If Infantry had that option, people would obviously lean to that.

@ducdai

Im thinking of slapping the new Atk smoke 4 on my shannan to prevent those cheat followups.

YEAH FUCK THEIR FAKE DOUBLES

[LadyLuna]

@Gin_Gitsune

But horses are very specific case, and it’s obvious you’d pick that over Lulls.

And horses are also one of the only two movement types that can get Lulls, so when everyone replaces Lulls with Traces on their cavs that dramatically reduces the amount of Lulls played period

They’re still very good skills, especially in Arena with all the Rallying that happens, they just got overshadowed by other skills

[GVader]

Honestly I prefer Lull’s over Traces, don’t get me wrong Traces are amazing, but depending on the unit preventing 2 sets of buffs can help a lot

[Gin_Gitsune]

I always saw lulz as 3 extra set of buffs.

[Yberus]

I have to say i gave speed smoke to muarim and I’m KINDA regretting it. I’m only training him in the FB and he won’t be +10 til long, but I rarely get to combat enough time for the DR to apply and be worth it. He may be great once he’s complete, but rn i think I’d rather keep the spd smoke for other shenanigans (I should’ve given it to Lyre ;; ), or maybe should’ve i sparked Gusty instead?? idk… The good thing is that this banner is going to happen again because is busted, so we will be able to re-spark a bunch of months from now, with more knowledge of what are the best uses for these skills.

[LadyLuna]

@Yberus

I rarely get to combat enough time for the DR to apply and be worth it

Yes, this is a weakness of these skills. You need to take part in multiple combats in the same turn for them to not be useless. I’ve mentioned it before, but they are most powerful on maps with a lot of enemies. Think Grand Conquests or any reinforcement maps, especially Abyssals. But most maps in FEH have only 3-5 enemies, which limits the potential of Smokes

Generally I think Menaces are the stronger skill for Arena because you’re usually trying to beat one enemy at a time (and it’s very difficult for a unit to be a one person army there), while Smokes are better if you’re trying to solo maps or simply fight many enemies at once

[Yberus]

You’re absolutely right. I’ll try to make him work with a galeforce build in AR-O (and GC or similar modes), so i don’t feel I wasted it, which i dont think i did 100%, but i can be pretty negative about foddering rare units/skills.

[LadyLuna]

That’s why I mainly wanted Lilith for her Catch (we haven’t had sparkable A/S Catch since Farina). The Smoke is just a bonus; I’m not sure exactly how well L-Nanna can use it, but it’d be nice to have on hand, and I can’t think of any other of my units who’d really like it

But I need a NY Lyre to do this. Hopefully the next DSH is kind

[Vicarious]

@Yberus

i can be pretty negative about foddering rare units/skills.

Tbh this happens to me a lot too. Probably only whales with all sort of premium fodder in their manuals have an easier time foddering 5* units away. Which is why I tend to overthink a lot when I need to deck out my units.

Imo Spd Smoke 4 is better used on PP units without sweep/desperation effects and without access to DR in other skills, and Muarim fits that category. So even if you may regret it a bit now he will most certainly put in the work when at +10 and max investment.

If you still have Divine Codes 2 to spare, a good idea would be to give him the F!Mareeta manual for FB4+NFU. With this set he has great synergy to use both a Galeforce set for AR-O and a special spamming set for PvE/Arena. Solid choice imo

[Yberus]

Ohhhhh i didnt think about her, thanks for the idea and for the reassuring <3 i’ll see if i have enough Codes, i got a bunch from the SD rewards and I may afford it!